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Re: Fictional Dates

Posted: Wed Jan 23, 2013 1:01 pm
by HerrPfister
This has always intrigued me, so here's what i've gleaned :

They are in Germany August 1981 - August / Spetember 1982. Here's how I came to this conclusion :

In 'Who won the War, anyway?', when Dennis is pleading Neville's case to Herr Ulrich and says Pfister 'must have made a mistake', Ulrich says Pfister is reliable, and digs a letter out of his files
"Here is my letter to Herr Pfister, dated August --". I can't remember the exact date stated (I think the 5th, off the top of my head), but it's definitely August because Ulrich pronounce it 'Owgust' which sticks in my mind because I have a German friend and that's how she pronounces it. Presumably, with the number of Brits clamouring to work abroad and the fact that Deninis implies Dusseldorf is one of the more desirable locations, they would have sgined on fairly quickly after that. So August is the start time.

Now, what prompts Oz to return to England in 'When the Boat comes in'? The news that Keegan has signed for Newcastle.

From Wikipedia :

Keegan had fallen out with McMenemy over the manager's failure to strengthen Southampton's defence (which conceded 67 goals in 1981–82) while the team was at the top of the table.[20] There were also rumours that McMenemy had charged the whole team of cheating after a 3–0 defeat by Aston Villa in April 1982 to which Keegan took great exception. Although Keegan joined Saints' next pre–season tour, he had already decided to move on to seek a new challenge, and a few days before the start of the 1982–83 season he signed for Second Division Newcastle United for a fee of £100,000.

The 82-83 season started on 28th August, according to footballsite.co.uk so they would have left around this time, meaning their stint in Germany was 1 year.

That's my theory anyway. if anyone can add to it, please do!

Ta-ra for a bit.

Re: Fictional Dates

Posted: Wed Jan 23, 2013 1:22 pm
by agabloodydoo
Aside from Moxey and Barry sunbathing I got the impression it was always cold on the site (Neville’s reference to proving they’d been in Germany was to come back with pneumonia).

I don’t know if it was conveniently timed or if written into the script, but didn’t the lads stop working in Germany due to the employment laws on foreign labour changing? Any idea when that was?

Slightly off topic…. But one thing I did notice last time I watched series 1 is that when the lads are in the office being told about the German labour laws changing, Bomber looks like he’s been sunburnt, however in the next shot where they’re in the bar (where Moxey reveals his record), the sunburn has gone!

Re: Fictional Dates

Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 4:12 am
by Gary M
Some footy related clues to the Series 1 timeline, whether intentional or otherwise:

1) the Sunderland Liege friendly match would've been before the season began, so July/August
2) Oz says he rang his missus to get the FA Cup draw - since Newcastle were in Div 2 at the time they would (i think) have entered in the 3rd round, which i think was drawn in December (?). I doubt whether Oz would've cared about the earlier rounds featuring teams from the lower divisions.
3) When Neville is listening to the Ajax-Bayern Munich game, the commentator mentions Jan Molby. According to Wikipedia, Molby played for Ajax 82-84.

Re: Fictional Dates

Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2013 9:11 pm
by Auf Wiedersehen, Pet
The date of the letter Barry sends to the lads is dated, Wednesday May 15th no year for the date. So, lets say Neville sees Dennis the same week in Newcastle, and Dennis says...'We'll gan dan Tuesday after dinner...' so that's 21st May......

So Neville and Dennis at 'The Bel and Dragon' is May 21st....
So working from those dates, the lads are at Thornley Manor on Monday 27th May?

Lee

Re: Fictional Dates

Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2013 12:38 pm
by Hallwood
It's a while since I saw the episode, but when Dennis tells them of the job at Thornley Manor, Barry says "but that only gives you... days to finish this!" I can't remember how many days he says they have to finish Barry's house.

Re: Fictional Dates

Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2013 12:55 pm
by Auf Wiedersehen, Pet
They start on Thornley Manor on a Monday, because Dennis tells them that at Barry's.....

Re: Fictional Dates

Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:24 pm
by Howard Radcliff
Auf Wiedersehen, Pet wrote:Great post Pete M.

I have often wondered the same, and only the other day, I remember figuring out once that they must have been in Germany through Christmas, but I cannot remember why I came to that conclusion now....
With reference to the lads spending Christmas in Dusseldorf I have the following theory:

In Series 1, Episode 2, (Who Won The War Anyway), Dennis and Neville talk to Herr Ulrich suggesting there must have been an ‘administrative cock up’ when relating to Neville’s employment as a carpenter. When Dagmar retrieves the records dated ‘August 4th’ we can assume the lads started work, say mid August at the earliest. 6 months would therefore take them through Christmas to mid January. The weather would have been considerably colder with rain, frost and likely snow certainly towards the latter episodes of Series 1. Anyone who has worked on a building site over winter will know construction work is very much weather dependent and unpredictable at this time of year!

Given the benefit of doubt - even if the lads had commenced work in say September or October, they would have most certainly spent a cold Christmas in that hut!! And not a Christmas decoration in sight eh!!

Re: Fictional Dates

Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 10:46 am
by Auf Wiedersehen, Pet
That could have been the same reason, but I can't remember its so long ago.....

Re: Fictional Dates

Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 10:48 am
by Auf Wiedersehen, Pet
I am trying to think of any dates mentioned in the Spanish episodes.
The only thing I can think of is the lads being in The Sun newspaper, the date might be possible to see.

Re: Fictional Dates

Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 5:13 pm
by Hedley Irwin
Howard Radcliffe wrote:
Auf Wiedersehen, Pet wrote:Great post Pete M.

I have often wondered the same, and only the other day, I remember figuring out once that they must have been in Germany through Christmas, but I cannot remember why I came to that conclusion now....
With reference to the lads spending Christmas in Dusseldorf I have the following theory:

In Series 1, Episode 2, (Who Won The War Anyway), Dennis and Neville talk to Herr Ulrich suggesting there must have been an ‘administrative cock up’ when relating to Neville’s employment as a carpenter. When Dagmar retrieves the records dated ‘August 4th’ we can assume the lads started work, say mid August at the earliest. 6 months would therefore take them through Christmas to mid January. The weather would have been considerably colder with rain, frost and likely snow certainly towards the latter episodes of Series 1. Anyone who has worked on a building site over winter will know construction work is very much weather dependent and unpredictable at this time of year!

Given the benefit of doubt - even if the lads had commenced work in say September or October, they would have most certainly spent a cold Christmas in that hut!! And not a Christmas decoration in sight eh!!
There's also Keegan signing in August (presumably the following August), and Barry telling Trevor that Dusseldorf in January was no picnic

Re: Fictional Dates

Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 10:25 pm
by Gary M
It is not possible to put together a definitive timeline for Series 1 since there are too many inconsistencies. The best we can do is evaluate the reliability of every piece of evidence:

FACT: Keegan signed in August. So assuming Oz isn't looking at an old newspaper we can indisputably place him in the hospital in August.

Wayne's(?) testimony: The lads spent 6 months in Dusseldorf.
Barry's testimony: The lads were in Dusseldorf in January.

Wayne(?) or Barry or both must have misspoken, since 6 months previous would be February. So Christmas in the hut is unlikely. (The weather is purely circumstantial. Any given day on site in Northern Europe can be unseasonably warm/cold sunny/cloudy.)

The letter dated August 4th suggests, but is not proof, that the lads started around then. If the "6 months duration" is even an approximation, then they must have been hired several months after the letter was sent.

Keegan signing date is the only hard fact.

Re: Fictional Dates

Posted: Wed Mar 06, 2013 4:41 pm
by Hedley Irwin
Gary M wrote:It is not possible to put together a definitive timeline for Series 1 since there are too many inconsistencies. The best we can do is evaluate the reliability of every piece of evidence:

FACT: Keegan signed in August. So assuming Oz isn't looking at an old newspaper we can indisputably place him in the hospital in August.

Wayne's(?) testimony: The lads spent 6 months in Dusseldorf.
Barry's testimony: The lads were in Dusseldorf in January.

Wayne(?) or Barry or both must have misspoken, since 6 months previous would be February. So Christmas in the hut is unlikely. (The weather is purely circumstantial. Any given day on site in Northern Europe can be unseasonably warm/cold sunny/cloudy.)

The letter dated August 4th suggests, but is not proof, that the lads started around then. If the "6 months duration" is even an approximation, then they must have been hired several months after the letter was sent.

Keegan signing date is the only hard fact.
You're a right little Hercule Parrot!

Just a thought, we know from If I Were a Carpenter that Dennis knew Dusseldorf already, and that Barry had worked with Dennis once before. So, when Barry said that Dusseldorf in January was no picnic, it is possible that he was referring to a previous visit.

Re: Fictional Dates

Posted: Thu Mar 07, 2013 12:46 pm
by AWP Corsa Tim
That's a damn good point Hedley!!

Re: Fictional Dates

Posted: Thu Mar 07, 2013 6:49 pm
by Breaking Away
Yes, well done bonny Lad!

Re: Fictional Dates

Posted: Thu Mar 07, 2013 6:54 pm
by Auf Wiedersehen, Pet
But, why would Barry mention that?
It wouldn't mean anything to the viewers, where as 'Dusseldorf in January is no picnic...' to viewers who have just watched Series 1, 2 years previous would know what he's on about.

I assume 90% of viewers wouldn't remember Barry telling Dennis in the first episode....'Barry, Barry Taylor, we worked together....' and Dennis saying...'We worked together once...'

I think he means when he was there, and he's also talking about the lads at the time.

Well, I've made me point.... :)